In today’s episode, I’m joined by Becky Robinson from Weaving Influence, a digital marketing agency that help helps authors promote their business books.

Since 2012, Becky has been building her business, but she didn’t start thinking this would turn into a big business, but one thing that she realised quickly is that she could create opportunities for other people. And that’s exactly what she did.

Today the company employs 12 people and they’re looking at buying their own building for the business. How incredible is that? Now it’s time for Becky to share her story and more important the journey that she’s been on as an entrepreneur so far.

Join us to find out more about what happens behind the scenes, how you can use marketing to help get your message out there, and most importantly, how you don’t always know where you’re going to end up when you first start.


Please subscribe, rate and review, and find us @AllAboutDigMar on TwitterFacebook, and Instagram to share your thoughts.

Get Social About It

Whether you’re thinking about starting a business, or you’re already running one, you’ll want to hear what @beckyrbnsn and @justchrisbruno talk about on this episode of the @AllAboutDigMar #podcast:

Stuff We Mentioned

Looking to reach out to Becky, or want to find some of the links we mentioned during our conversation, you can find everything below:

Chris Bruno 0:01
Welcome to the all about digital marketing podcast, the show all about digital marketing, digital marketing, digital marketing, digital marketing, brought to you by social Inc. digital marketing agency specialising in social media and content marketing for great brands and forward thinking SMEs. I’m your host, Chris Bruno. And as always, we’re here to bring you the most actionable tips, tricks, tools and insights to help you achieve more when it comes to your digital marketing. Subscribe to the show. And be sure to share with a friend if you found something useful or interesting. You can find all the show notes and more information on www dot all about digital

Becky, thank you so much for joining me today.

Becky Robinson 0:56
Thanks. It’s so great to be here.

Chris Bruno 0:58
Awesome, and I’ve tried my whole Just as much energy as possible, because as we were just talking about, it’s only 11am for you, but it’s actually the end of the day nearly for us. And it’s four o’clock on here in the UK. But for anybody who doesn’t know you, Becky, can you tell us a little bit about yourself and what you’re currently doing?

Becky Robinson 1:14
I am happy to so I am the founder and CEO of a digital marketing agency called Weaving Influence. I started my business in 2012. I’m also a mom and a marathon runner. And I’m exceedingly passionate about creating opportunities for others.

Chris Bruno 1:31
This is awesome. You’re going to give me so much to talk about already just there in your introduction. So let’s start off with the business side of things. So you said you started in 2012? How’s the journey been? You know, you’re eight years into it. How’s everything going? And what are some of the challenges maybe that you faced in those eight years?

Becky Robinson 1:48
Sure. I’m happy to share that. So one of the things that’s unique about me as I never really set out to start a business. I was looking for a career after having stayed home with my daughters for about nine years. And I started doing some freelance work. And I soon saw that some opportunities were coming my way. So I started taking on some freelance projects. And pretty soon I realised that I couldn’t deliver all the work myself, which is how I started to build a team back in 2012. So I never had a business plan, I never really had any goals written down on paper, or, you know, necessarily any vision of where I would go except for I was really inspired by this idea of wanting to create opportunities for others, particularly as a mom, you know, I really value having a flexible job that allows me to be present with my kids, you know, I make dinner every night. I like to take time to exercise and read and you know, pursue hobbies outside of work. And so, my idea was, whatever life it is that I want to create for me, there are other, you know, women or other people who would like to be able to have that same opportunity to have work that fits their lives that’s meaningful and purposeful, but yet doesn’t completely take over. And so I started higher team Back in 2012. And, you know, fast forward eight years, we now have an employed team that numbers 12 we have a number of contractors who contribute to our work. And what what I said before, you know, I’m most compelled by this idea of creating opportunities for others, and the chance to really build relationships with my team and see that them thrive in learning new skills and contributing to projects and new new ways. And that part has been a lot of fun. In terms of challenges, there have been so many, you know, anytime you hire people, people are messy. And, you know, sometimes hiring decisions don’t work out, which can be really painful. You know, I’ve hired friends and family members and had, you know, situations blow up. And that’s no fun. You know, there have been times where our expenses have exceeded our revenue. And you know, there are those times as a startup entrepreneur that you pay the team you You take personal money to do so, you know, for many years not taking a paycheck. So there are those financial challenges. I think that every entrepreneur faces.

Chris Bruno 4:09
I think some of those points that you mentioned, there are huge and massive become as a massive surprise to a lot of people when they start out. And actually, I don’t know why. And I think it’s because more people don’t actually talk about that. They talk about the benefits and how great it is, and now that they’re self employed, or that they own their own business, but they don’t necessarily talk about like you just mentioned there those months, especially in the early days, where you’re not taking salary where you have to keep pumping in money necessarily to help cover whatever it might be wages, rent or anything else. And I think those challenges actually have a huge impact on the founder on the owners of the business, more than a lot of people realise and it’s something I think there’s coming to light a lot more that it can actually be a very heavy mental strain for people as well. Have you found that along the way on the journey I know I have for sure. But have you found that as well that it’s been quite difficult at some times To keep finding that focus and that energy to carry on when things are getting tough or when things are sort of adverse.

Becky Robinson 5:07
Well, certainly there have been those lonely and scary moments, a mentor of mine, her name is Whitney Johnson, she’s a best selling author. Definitely check her out. One of the things that she often says and I actually heard her say it on her podcast when I was listening last week, if you’re, if you’re lonely, and it’s scary, you’re on the right track. So what I would say is for any entrepreneurs out there who’s really feeling those moments of discouragement or feeling alone or you know, being surprised by the roadblocks, there are so many moments like that, you know, moments spent crying at my desk, or you know, I remember times of just stopping at the grocery store on my way to work and just praying, you know, God, I need your help to keep going today. You know, help me figure this out. It’s scary right now. You know where I am right now. Eight years in is a little little bit different. So one of the great pleasures of my work work life right now is that I have a couple of vice presidents who are working in my company with me. And both of them have worked with me for many years. And so we have this loyalty and connection now, where I can really depend upon them. And it definitely feels less lonely and less scary because we are sharing the goals and the vision for the company. And we’re co creating together the future that we want to build. So I feel a lot more kind of surrounded and supported now than I did you know, in those early years. So even though I am the owner, I feel them sharing ownership with me in a way that really helps to make the whole endeavour so much more joyful.

Chris Bruno 6:42
That’s, that’s a huge thing. And I think, again, it’s the support mechanism that people have around them, especially when you said like you mentioned there, those lonely days where you feel like everything’s coming down on you and it can be it can be a bit of a dark cloud around you at that time. And we were talking on the podcast with Travis catcher A friend of mine now, but I met him in 2013 in LA at a San Francisco actually at a conference. And he’s a founder, he’s now set up two very successful businesses. But on his own at those times, the two of us would kind of have these chats where we realised that actually, you do have a support network, and there are people you can reach out to. And I mean, that’s something that’s really important, you know, if you are struggling or if things feel hard, or anything like that, actually do try and reach out, try and find people that either have experienced those same things. I think, Becky, you just mentioned there, you know, one of your mentors, I think that’s one of the huge things and in business, especially, that you can find other people that’ll be willing to share insight to help you through bad times to help you understand what you’re going through and understand that you’re not alone going through these things as well. So I think that’s very, very important. And I think Becky as well, I’ll drop the link to your friend, the author into the show notes as well if that’s okay with you, just so that people can that can check her out as well. And so in terms of the business that you’re that you’re running, it’s it’s very much a niche industry that you’ve you’ve ended up in, is this something that just sort of happened by accident? Or was this due to the opportunities that you that you found back in 2012?

Becky Robinson 8:10
Sure, it actually started before 2012. So I arrived on the social media scene and about 2009 when an old friend encouraged me to set up a Facebook account. So one of our core services in the beginning was social media marketing. The other place that the kind of beginnings of my business came from was that I had been working as a social media marketing director for a leadership consultant. And one of his first projects for me was launching his business book. So I put together social media marketing plans, this was probably back in say, 2011. And what happened was, as I was promoting this consultants book on social media channels, specially Twitter, I made a lot of new relationships. So then other business book authors were seeing what I had done, and asking me if I would be willing to partner with them on their launches. Whitney Johnson, who I referenced actually her first Book in 2012 was one of the very first books we launched. And part of the reason was I met her and her story and her book was so compelling that I was willing to take a risk and you know, kind of offer my services out there in the market outside the job that I previously had. So basically, I began to be known for this niche of using social media to market business books. And since 2012, my team and I have launched over 130 business books, and that really is what we’re most known for. But we also have a wide range of digital marketing services that we offer to our clients.

Chris Bruno 9:35
It’s incredible, and I think that’s, um, it’s a, it’s an interesting way for it to develop. And I think this is what’s really cool about business. And one of the things I love most about the podcast, everyone I talked to has a different story of how they get to where they are. And I think that’s amazing to be able to build those relationships and then from those relationships to have opportunities present themselves, and then also having the courage to jump on that opportunity. Because I think there’s something about sometimes people kind of feel these things almost seemed too good to be true or a knock on effect, or Actually, no, I’ve already got a job. I shouldn’t really go into this. But it sounds like by seizing that opportunity, it really has changed your life over the last eight years.

Becky Robinson 10:15
Well, and not only mine, but the dozens of men and women that I’ve worked with over this eight years. So the thing Chris, that stands out the most to me, is, you know, I could have made a choice to just go down the track of being a solo consultant or solo marketing person, but that decision to open up a business to include others, and to build a team. It’s been life changing for many of the people who have chosen to work with me across these eight years. So would it be okay if I share a couple of stories with you? Absolutely. Okay, so one of my favourite stories is a young woman. Well, she’s still young, she was even younger back in 2012. I met her on Twitter One morning, and she was transitioning from a job as a pharmacy tech had a dream of being a writer. editor, and I happen to, you know, connect on Twitter. She lived in Tennessee, I lived in Michigan. And I ended up hiring her as one of my very first team members. You know, eight years later, she’s since adopted five kids from Costa Rica. And the fact that I’ve created a business where she has flexibility allows her to do the work that she loves in a way that fits with her family life. So I know that carries life is different, because I chose to do this. So I think oftentimes, we don’t think about the possible benefits involved with the risk. So it can feel risky, you know, to leave a steady job, start a business. But for me, taking the focus away from myself and what I might be able to achieve for me and putting the focus on the people of my business, and how the business could matter to them, helped me to overcome some of that fear and resistance in the tough moments. So when I can really focus on the individual lives of my team members and the way that I see the impact of the way that we built our business on each of them individually that propels Me past kind of the resistance of like, Hey, I don’t want to take this risk or this is too hard or I’d like to quit. You know, you can quit when it’s just you. But when you have 10, or 12 or 15 people who are counting on you for income and opportunities, it’s not, it’s not an option anymore. So when quitting is not an option, the only thing that you can do, Chris is to keep going.

Chris Bruno 12:23
I couldn’t agree more. And I started social Inc. in 2008. I had just opened a taking a little office that I had used all my savings pretty much to pay for the first six months, rent at the time. And then about two and a half weeks into it. I was watching Sky News, and I watched the collapse of Lehman Brothers, and then watch the turmoil of what was classified as the world’s biggest financial crisis in recent years. And I sat there with my head in my hands thinking What have I done? But the nice thing is, like you said, you start to build and you start to create and you realise as opportunities and you push through. And absolutely the same way. You know, we have four core team members, we have a multitude of freelancers that we work with and contractors that we work with. And actually, you’re completely right when you have those other team members, when you have people that are dependent on you, when you have contracts as well, even you know, we’ve got relationships that go back to 2011, where we’re still working with those companies. And I feel, and I don’t want to use the word obligation, but I feel a loyalty towards them. That would stop me as well from being able to just simply pack up shop tomorrow and walk away. And I think that’s something that’s a huge, it’s a huge indication of the kind of people that you become, when once you realise that it’s not just about yourself, it’s not just about your bottom line. It’s not just about your bank account. It’s actually what you can do and what the bigger implications are and what the bigger impacts are, that every business can have.

Becky Robinson 13:50
I love that. Thank you. I had I hadn’t thought to mention, you know, the long term relationships with clients and how those are a big part of what compels us to I love that

Chris Bruno 13:59
right? I think you end up with two kinds of two kinds of founders, I think you, you almost get the capitalists kind of, I just want to do this to make money. And then you kind of get the idealist, which is I’m going to change the world. And I think you need a nice mix or blend of the two, to make sure that you’re realistic in terms of, well, yes, we need money, and it has to make money in a business should be profitable. That’s the whole point of doing it. But at the same time, a little bit of that ideology of you know, I want to do something that’s going to have an impact, I want to do something that that’s going to benefit other people, because you mentioned something that I think is really important. You want to give other people opportunities. And that might be your client who wants to release a book and have that kind of message, get out there and help other people. Or it could be as simple as like you mentioned, your staff members and people that I think for at least for me become the feeling of an extended family, as opposed to members of staff. But that’s how it works in small businesses.

Becky Robinson 14:55
Definitely, I totally agree with you that those two levels of opportunities that work Creating. So we’re creating opportunities for our clients to do the work that they want to and reach their goals and build their messages in the in the world and creating opportunities for the team to do the work that they love. Everybody wins.

Chris Bruno 15:14
That’s that’s always the goal, Win Win, right?

Becky Robinson 15:17
Well, yes. And I mean, you know, I think about the difference when people are thriving and happy at work. That trickles down to the clients that we’re serving, they can see our energy for serving them well, and they can see our passion for joining them and in whatever activity we’re delivering to them. And it’s just better all the way around.

Chris Bruno 15:37
So I’ve spoken to a couple of agency owners, and one of the themes that we keep kind of discussing and I want to ask you, if you found this as well, is you know, we’re very much community building focused through digital channels. That’s pretty much what we do. And that involves a lot of social media, a lot of content creation, everything else, but we find that we become much more than just marketing Managers for our clients, we found, you know, and the way I think where Jason put it on one of our previous episodes was, you know, you almost become like a business consultant to help some of these businesses and some of these early stages, founders or authors for your sake, maybe, and you almost end up helping them with not just, you know, this is how you launch a book, and this is what we would do online. And this is the marketing kind of plan for it, but also trying to help them to understand the mechanics of what goes behind that. Would you say that’s true for you as well?

Becky Robinson 16:29
You know, in some cases, yes, we do have the privilege of pouring in in a different way. And I think, honestly, that clients are surprised by that, you know, they come in the door for one thing, and then soon, we see that we can inspire or encourage or direct them, you know, in a much bigger way in terms of how they take their businesses as a result of having brought a book into the world. So I I definitely see that and really, that comes from the relationship that we develop. So one of the core values that we Talk about a lot in our company as the value of partnership. And it’s important to me when people hire our organisation, that they’re not hiring a vendor, but that they really are hiring a partner. And that partnership means that we are invested in our client success and, you know, really wanting to understand what motivates them what they hope to accomplish in the world. And that’s, you know, beyond sometimes just the marketing outcomes that we’re looking to achieve.

Chris Bruno 17:26
I think that’s a really nice way of putting it and for me, I’d have to agree with you 100%, in terms of, it’s the feeling of, we’re working together to do this for both of our benefits, but it has to have that feeling to it. And we find that actually, you know, over the years, we’ve had lots of situations where you know, I’ll get an email saying how much to do social media. And I’ll reply basically with something remarkably tongue in cheek, which I probably shouldn’t, but I’ll reply with something along the lines of you know, how long is a piece of string because what is You want, you know, do you want me to write you five tweets and charge you a tenner? Well, okay, we can do that. But I really don’t want to, and it’s not going to have any impact on your business. And we found that by helping clients to understand a more holistic approach. So whether it be a blend of inbound, outbound, social content, written video, whatever it might be, but by having that ability to be able to have open conversations where you can tell them, you know, this is what we’re going to do. This is an experiment for something else. And this is how we’re going to try and change and challenge these opinions. These are the ways that we’re going to communicate with people, invariably the results prove themselves, they, they, they’re the things that really, you know, solidify the foundations in the future. And I think that’s the most important part. So I don’t really think I have a question. I’m just though I think I’m just kind of rambling and kind of backing up what you said. But it’s this idea that I was reading about this recently, again, but scarcity versus abundance kind of mentality. And I think there’s huge opportunities out there at the moment and by Understanding that if you just want to hire someone to write tweets for you, then give it a go see what happens, try and track the results. If you’re looking to get a real consultancy or an agency involved to help your business, then you have to have that relationship you have to trust and value them, and what they’re going to do for you and be aligned with that idea and that vision. So as you can actually get the the fruits of the labour, you can reap what you sow at the end of it as well.

Becky Robinson 19:25
I agree with you on that wholeheartedly. Chris, and I’m curious, do you deal with the situation where people want more immediate results, then content marketing and social marketing can actually deliver? And how do you deal with that?

Chris Bruno 19:39
Yeah, absolutely. I think it’s something that we we try very hard to manage expectations. So if anybody’s talking to me about a 30 day plan to do X, will be very blunt and say we don’t think we’ll get results in 30 days. And it’s as simple as that and anyone who’s promising you results in 30 days is going to take your money and run now, the difference Sort of having been around for a while now, you know, we’re coming up to in September, I’ll be 12 years since we started. But by having that kind of authority in terms of, you know, I’ve done this for a long time I’ve seen what works, what doesn’t. And invariably, the two conversations we end up having is either the timeframe, or the cost. And those seem to be the things that people focus on, which is completely for me anyway is completely barmy. In the sense of, you know, we’re talking about building a community, something that will serve you for the rest of your life or for the rest of the company’s life, if you do it correctly. And if you’re willing to put that investment in, and people don’t often understand that, that comes with a huge amount of human interaction, you know, with the best will in the world. You can set up a bot to answer people on your Facebook page if you want to. But that’s not the same as somebody actually a physical human, taking the time to engage on your behalf of your brand into Twitter chats, or get involved in conversations or start or even you know, join other conversations on your behalf. All of those things. Take a huge amount of human resource to do properly and to do well and to help you actually build that community. So we tried very hard to bring that to the very initial conversations. And it’s something I learned probably about eight, nine years ago, after having done this for a couple of years that at the very beginning, you kind of end up chasing bad profits, or at least what I call bad profits, which is this idea that, you know, we need to make money as a business, we’ve got staff, we’ve got overheads, we’ve got rent, we’ve got whatever it might be, and therefore we have to take on work. And now I’m very aware and very conscious that if something feels like it’s going to be a bad fit, I’d rather not work with them, because the end result is going to be I can’t manage their expectations. I can’t help them to see that this is a longer term process rather than short term wins. I can’t help them understand the value of the product if they just don’t see it. And invariably at the end of that, I either end up getting somebody that hates us or says that it doesn’t work or even worse than that, you know, goes around, telling people Content marketing and social media marketing is for suckers, it doesn’t work or anything else, when in the reality of it is they just haven’t invested in the right way or they haven’t valued it as a process to take place over three to six months as opposed to over three to six weeks.

Becky Robinson 22:14
That whole managing expectations thing is really challenging. But I love Chris, the reminder that it’s okay to say no to work that isn’t going to be profitable, if you know that you’re not going to be able to please the client or get the results they want. That’s, for me been a hard lesson. Certainly.

Chris Bruno 22:31
I think that’s how most of us have done it. Unfortunately, if it was easy, then we’d all know it from day one. But that the reality is though as well, when you are starting a business, you do have very different needs to when you’re slightly more established. But I think the important thing is again, if you just say yes to everything, the chances are you’re not doing something very, very well. You’re just constantly saying yes and trying to sort of tick boxes. Whereas I think when you can stick to what you honestly believe and this is something that Well, that when you’re first starting out in a business or anything else, people are very vanilla. They want to kind of come across as if they can do everything for anyone. And they’re very sort of, you know, we don’t we’re not very divisive or anything like that in terms of our opinions or anything else. And I think that’s wrong, you know, if you can, if you can explain what your opinion or what your belief is, and you know, we’re very big on banging the same drum because we honestly do believe that for us, it’s using social media and digital channels to build community and put social back into social media. You’ll basically see that message and everything that we do and blog articles and videos, even I’ll personal blogs with myself and my co director, James, but we’re constantly banging a drum that is not for everybody. And we’re okay with that. Because we don’t want to attract everybody. We want to attract the people, the businesses that actually do want to build a community that actually do want to have real conversations that will lead to conversions and lead to building a community that will help them not just today, not Just with the product launch today, but actually in five years time, it’ll help them with referrals over that time, it will help them with people talking about them with brand recognition, with people actually engaging with their content when they’re sharing it, because you tick a box for them, which is they either agree or disagree. And that’s something that I think is a is a hard transition for for a lot of people to do because they’re scared of alienating when actually, they don’t realise that when you alienate half of the people, you’re also bringing half of the people really close to you at the same time.

Becky Robinson 24:30
That makes perfect sense. I bet you have some great stories about amazing connections. You’ve met me through social media over the years to I don’t I don’t know, Chris, I feel like some of the channels have shifted a lot, you know, since I began and maybe since you began, I feel like it’s harder to make those genuine connections now than it was back in 2010. Any thoughts on that?

Chris Bruno 24:53
I absolutely agree. And you know, these these platforms are constantly evolving, but I think the important things That, again, I genuinely believe social media, for example, is one of the biggest opportunities still today for any small business or mid sized business. It gives you an opportunity to connect with people, it gives you an opportunity to talk to people to get feedback from people to ask questions, and find out where you should be going next with your product development or anything like that. But the reality is, it’s harder to get results from it from a business perspective. But that’s also because too many people are just shouting into the void. And this is something I talk about loads, you know, we come across brands that we’ve met that we talked to, and actually we end up sort of either consulting with or offering them some help. And we’ll look at what they do. And these will be big companies, you know, they’re paying either staff members or marketing companies or whatever it might be to create and do social for them. And we’ve had conversations, you know, with, we had one with actually with an IT company a few pretty about eight months ago. And one of their comments to us was, you know, no, we pay an agency to run this For us, and it costs us a couple of thousand every month. And they said, fantastic. I said, What sort of results are you getting? And they said, What do you mean results? They said, Well, what were the objectives that you set out to achieve? And how close are you to achieving all those objectives for this year? And literally, the call went deathly quiet. Now, that sounds like something that just shouldn’t ever happen. You know, what are we trying to do? We’re trying to do X, we’re trying to raise the awareness of the brand, we’re trying to create people or create engagement or create conversations or find out what people want, whatever it might be. But without having that starting stone or that stepping stone of this is what we want to achieve. Now, how do we achieve it? What brands are invariably doing is they’re just spending money to bang out these messages. They’re all to reshare content from news channels or industry channels. And literally you’re like that, what for? Who’s benefiting from this unless you’re going to add your opinion your stake in it, what you believe or how you believe it, how your company is dealing with this or how you can help a client with that. What that change might be in the industry. But without adding any of that all you’re doing is reposting other people’s content that the chances are if your community is really into what you do in your industry, they’ve probably already seen that content somewhere else. So what’s the reason for them to engage with you? And I think it can be very easy to get lost in that. And before you realise it, you’ve been spending two years pumping out content. And actually, you’re getting nothing back for it.

Becky Robinson 27:25
Right? Well, that reminder to really focus on making sure that any investment that you’re making in marketing is connected to goals and metrics is really critical.

Chris Bruno 27:35
Absolutely. Like Well, the three feathers from from your side when you’re helping an author launch a business book, for example, what sort of things are key elements for you or key elements as part of that launch, or that marketing that you think other small businesses or mid sized businesses can really use as a takeaway to help them with their business?

Becky Robinson 27:55
Well, I think it’s important to have some bigger picture goals and priorities related to any investor in marketing, you know, so many of our clients who are writing a business book, they know that they’re not going to get back dollar for dollar, what they invest in marketing, on book sales, selling business books is exceedingly difficult. And if people publish with the traditional publisher, the revenues or royalties that they’re getting from each book, you know, are not very much. And so it’s important for us whenever we start a project with an author to really think about, well, what’s the outcome that they want to achieve beyond just book sales. So, you know, potentially their book is a credibility builder that will allow them to raise the rates on their speaking or consulting or, you know, they want to build awareness for their message, they want to reach more people. And whenever possible, what we try to do is get a lot more granular, because it’s not really helpful to just say, Well, I want to build awareness for that message. So well, what is building awareness for the message look like? You know, how will we know when we’ve achieved that outcome? And so we, you know, as we scope work for clients, when we’re writing a proposal, or you know, when we’re writing a strategy, we try Get as specific as possible as it relates to the outcomes that they’re hoping to achieve and how we’re going to know we were successful together. You know, there are some kind of small things like, you know, becoming an Amazon bestseller getting that banner on your book. And then there are some bigger things like lead generation that our clients want to achieve. And getting as specific as possible really helps them to know that the work has been worthwhile. There is though, one other kind of tangible benefit that I think clients get from working with us that isn’t necessarily tied to metrics. And that has to do with really demystifying the process of marketing a book and making it more joyful. So part of the value that we bring is really understanding what each author is going through at each stage of marketing their business, and being able to identify how we can best support them in terms of answering confusing questions and, you know, helping them figure out next steps and, you know, you can’t really track that to metrics, but it’s, you know, at the end of the experience, like Was this a more joyful book marketing experience because I had a partner who was experienced and helped me know what to expect and who was experienced and help me make sure I was investing my energy in the right ways at the right times.

Chris Bruno 30:10
I think that’s huge as well. And it’s, again, an education process that I still feel that we’re on on a regular basis. And you know, every business and every brand knows that they should be marketing or knows that they should be using social or whatever that might be. But having these conversations on the podcast, talking to people on a day to day basis for for our agency, and in a consultant capacity, there is still a huge amount of education that needs to go out there and to help people because invariably, and I’m sure you’ve had the conversation before with people as well, when you first start, they’ll say, Well, you know, we’ll we’ll ask what’s the goal, and they’ll say, make more revenue. And you’ll say, Okay, well, let’s break that down a little bit. And even just that educational step or that help and that consultancy step to help them break down what that actually looks like because like you mentioned, you know, launching a book is, it’s not just about making sales and making money off the book, it’s about, you know, becoming an authority within your domain or within within your sector. It’s about having that thought leadership out there that can can help you then to secure higher rates on your consultancy business, or you’re speaking opportunities or even open up new speaking opportunities. It can do so many things, and all of those things will invariably impact revenue. But you’re no longer looking at the goal of what what’s the dollar for dollar result. Because if that’s the only thing you’re looking at, then you’re probably missing out on half of the opportunities that are actually presenting themselves from the marketing efforts in the first place.

Becky Robinson 31:42
That’s definitely true. You have to know what to look for.

Chris Bruno 31:46
It’s always a challenge to to know. But again, if you’re listening to this, don’t don’t hesitate to contact us, either Becky or myself and ask questions. You know, that’s the whole beauty of social media from my side of it anyway, when I want I know something or when I’m trying to figure something out, I can go out there. And I can ask people that have been there that have done that, that have seen this. And you can ask questions and people invariably, most of the time, I’m not going to say everybody all the time, but most people will come back. And they will take the time to put a little bit of effort in and, and reply to you and give you some insight or give you some helpful tips or even just a bit of a point in the right direction. And that’s something that can really help you in terms of what your efforts are going towards or what you’re really focused on. And Becky from your side, what do you think are the biggest opportunities right now in terms of the channels in terms of the mediums or anything like that? What what sort of things do you think really presenting great opportunities for for small to mid sized businesses?

Becky Robinson 32:41
Well, so I’m going to say something a little bit maybe counterintuitive, and contrary to what others might say. So primarily, the types of businesses that we’re consulting with are, you know, solo business owners who are consultants or coaches or training organisations. That’s the niche of the particular clients that we’re serving and One of the things that I think is a huge opportunity for any of those smaller organisations is to make sure that any investment that they’re making in marketing is sustainable. So I know a lot of social consultants might say, you know, you need to be on LinkedIn, you need to be on Instagram, you need to be on Twitter, on Facebook, on Snapchat, you need to do all the channels. And where I’m seeing the greatest opportunity is really with clients who choose to focus on a channel where they enjoy showing up and where their target audiences can be found. So in many cases with our clients, we’re not advising folks to start a Twitter presence if they don’t already have one. I would far rather see people make a commitment to showing up in a meaningful way on one channel than to spread their attention across five. So a big opportunity is created a cadence of content marketing and social marketing that is sustainable for you that you can execute on faithfully where you can have the energy and joy to show up and make real connections and let go of all the rest. And you know, my clients love hearing that, right? Because they don’t want to be told that they have to show up everywhere. And I don’t think there’s a lot of value in showing up everywhere. So, yeah, for what it’s worth, there’s a sustainable value to be gained by focused, consistent efforts, making a commitment to a particular cadence of social content marketing, and showing up and letting go of all the rest. We only have so much time and we only have so much money and focusing that time and investment is really critical.

Chris Bruno 34:34
You’ve reminded me of something happened to me about five, maybe six years ago, but we started talking to a company, fairly good company in terms of size, revenues and everything else. And their idea was we want to be on social media. And then we thought this is fantastic. So this was before the days of Snapchat or Tick Tock or anything like that. But it was a case of we want Twitter, Facebook, LinkedIn, YouTube, and We want to make it all work. And it’s got to be great. And one thing that and so we sort of took a step back. And the first question obviously is, well, you know, budgets for all these things, you know, it’s going to start to cost a lot of money, especially when we get into the video stuff. This was back in 2014, I think. And so it was long before you could pick up your iPhone and have 4k or anything like that. It was before live broadcasting on Facebook and things like that, as well. So it required a lot of effort and sort of input, let’s say, and one of the questions that we just sort of asked after the budget question, which clearly stated that, you know, this was never going to work. But one of the questions was, what are you going to post on all these things? And they turned to us and they said, Well, that’s what we’re hiring you for. And I was like that, but but what’s the goals? What are you trying to do? What, what is it that’s actually going to bring value to the audience that you’re trying to target? And at that point, they just kind of looked at us and again, I think what you said there, you know, instead of trying to be all things to all men on all platforms, actually consider distantly turning up and enjoying turning up on one platform will have more of an impact, especially in the early stages of a business or when resources like you mentioned, time especially, are limited. You will get more value from that and build a better community on one platform than you would if you started spreading yourself so thin you don’t particularly like the video busy you’re doing on YouTube, but you’re just doing them for the sake of doing them. And then suddenly that comes through it permeates into every aspect of your messaging of how you’re talking of your body language, your your tone, everything represents that that you’re just kind of showing up because you feel you have to.

Becky Robinson 36:37
Hmm, yeah, that’s really helpful. My favourite place to show up currently is Instagram. I have a lot of fun with Instagram personally, maybe more than professionally. How about you?

Chris Bruno 36:50
So that’s actually really interesting because this is a question I’ve been asking all of our guests for the last couple of months. And my personal favourite at the moment is probably actually turning into LinkedIn. Not just for the work stuff, but even for the kind of conversation and getting involved in conversations. It’s just really hitting the mark for me in terms of what I want to talk about. And and then for a little bit of a distraction, it’s very much things like Twitter. I enjoy short brief, I can come in and out. And I don’t feel like I’m getting sucked in for for the large amount of periods of time. But it’s quite interesting. Like, can I ask you why you say Instagram is is your favourite at this stage.

Becky Robinson 37:29
I love the visual on Instagram. And, you know, just the chance to see glimpses of people’s lives. I like the chance to discover new people to follow based on hashtags that I’m interested in. And I love the Instagram story feature. Just seeing something you know, for a moment, you know, a person’s experience in that moment in time. I actually follow someone on Instagram named Maggie Smith poet, maybe you can put a link to her Instagram in the show notes and Maggie’s really focused on kind of explaining the journey of going through difficult times. And she’s not actually even sharing photos, she uses like a consistent blue background and has her quote, and it pops up and almost every time I want to reshare it or add it to my story. So just the reason I guess, to summarise that I like Instagram is just the moments of inspiration that come either from a quote that someone is sharing or an image or glimpse of their life and just the visual aspect, more than the text aspect.

Chris Bruno 38:32
So in terms of because that’s for your personal side, but in terms of for for work for professional, so either for yourself or for your clients, what are you finding are that the other channel that works the best on on a scale of, you know, for the majority of people that you’re working with

Becky Robinson 38:50
LinkedIn for sure, obviously, because if you’re looking to build a business and professional connections, you know, we’re seeing our clients get great traction from the And I would I would say, though, when I talk about what I like about Instagram, it’s not only for the personal side, it’s also the professional side, because I feel like in order to be memorable with potential customers or existing customers, you really have to have them see a glimpse of your whole life and your brand is a story that you’re telling. And so I, I love Instagram, from the perspective of it’s a way to show people a glimpse of my whole life, you know, I’m a business owner, and I’m a runner, and, you know, I’m interested in, you know, books, and you know, I have a family and I like to cook and you know, you’re not going to share that kind of breadth of the experience of a business owner on LinkedIn. You know, I’m not going to talk about my kids on LinkedIn. But I think the more people know about you, the more they can be connected to you and your story and remember you and your story,

Chris Bruno 39:51
read completely. Okay, so in terms of your Instagram profile, is it open and Can anybody follow

Becky Robinson 39:57
it? Sure, as it’s Becky rbms And so my last name without the vowels, Becky Robinson, but leave out all the vowels. Same with my Twitter account. I, you know, I couldn’t get my name back in the day when I set up the account. So I’ve been using it that way for a long time. And yes, you’re free to find me. I’ll tell you it’s mostly running pictures at the moment. But some work things to Chris, we’re about as a company to embark on a really exciting journey to owning a building. And the building is going to require some extensive renovations if everything comes together. And I’m excited about using Instagram to show the visual story of this building becoming a home for my company for years into the future. Again, not probably something I share on LinkedIn, but something that I can use, you know, video and, and photos on Instagram to bring to

Chris Bruno 40:46
life. That sounds like you’re gonna have some some stressful days with builders and everything else that’s going to come next

Becky Robinson 40:55
potentially, so but again, as I referenced earlier, I do have some people on my team who are going to stay And with me in those stressful moments.

Chris Bruno 41:03
Glad to hear. Well listen, Becky, this has been fantastic and I think we could probably carry on talking for hours on end about all of these things. And thank you so much for agreeing to come on today. And just quickly where’s the best place to find you online or connect with you

Becky Robinson 41:18
sure to places so check out our company website at weaving influence calm, you can check out my personal brand blog where I write so infrequently at Becky Robinson calm and that one does have all the vowels. You can read about my journey as an entrepreneur there. You know, we already talked about my Instagram or if folks want to email me or have questions about my journey, email me Becky at weaving influence. com.

Chris Bruno 41:45
That’s fantastic. Becky, thank you so much.

Becky Robinson 41:47
Thank you, Chris. It’s been a pleasure. I hope that you found some energy in the late afternoon.

Chris Bruno 41:53
A lot thanks to you,

Becky Robinson 41:54
Sure. Take care.

Chris Bruno 41:58
The all about digital marketing podcast is brought to you by social Inc. A distributed digital marketing agency specialised in delivering results through online campaigns. Whether it’s content marketing, social media marketing, online advertising or web design, we’ve got you covered from strategy through to delivery. If you’re struggling with your digital marketing, get in touch today by simply visiting www dot social

Transcribed by

Music by Hani Koi from Fugue